P  E  Y  T  O  N     W  O  L  C  O  T  T
h o w   w e   t a k e   b a c k   o u r   c h i l d r e n ' s    e d u c a t i o n  --
o n e   p e r s o n ,   o n e   q u e s t i o n ,   o n e   s c h o o l   a t   a   t i m e .        
  Copyright 1999-2006 Peyton Wolcott
Commentary
TRANSPARENCY/PUBLIC RECORDS UPDATE
THE TRANSPARENCY SITUATION IN OUR U.S. PUBLIC SCHOOLS - PART III
NOT MUCH, NOT YET--TINY GLIMMERS OF HOPE SHINING BRIGHT AMID TROUBLESPOTS
By Peyton Wolcott
November 6, 2006/1 a.m.
CLOSEUP: public records
searches around the U.S.
QUESTION:  How can Ysleta ISD supe Hector Montenegro
promote behavior such as this
(below middle) from some
employees yet stifle others such that at least one was willing
to stand in silent protest at the mic in front of the school board
with tape over his mouth for three minutes last July?
Texas
Oh, Texas, my Texas  
Our series on transparency ends
today with a trip to the Lone Star
State where we're looking at
Cleburne ISD, just south of
Dallas/Fort Worth, Eanes ISD
(west
of Austin) (again) and
Lake Travis
ISD
(picking up where we left off in
Part II) and its neighbor
Leander
ISD,  
the cluster theory at work.

But first we go to
Ysleta, in the El
Paso
suburbs, where, if you are
only judging the state of things by
these photos at right, administra-
tors spend their time dancing and
wearing funny hats and carrying
rubber duckies.

I love my native state.  I really do.  My
family is here by choice--after
spending many years away, we
picked the Hill Country out of all of
the places available to us, and
moved back home.  

Sometimes in this life it
helps to have a sense of
perspective and a sense of
humor.  
Of course we realize that
administrators don't spend all of
their time dancing and that
teenaged girls don't go to school
dressed like clowns (far right) every
day.

By the same token,
administrators need to
realize
that while not all parents
are filing thousands or even
hundreds of public records
requests, when they do, just as with
the dancing and the costumes and
the rubber duckies, there's likely a
reason.  And rather than trying to
stifle such messengers, supes
would serve themselves and their
communities better by inviting these
folks in and asking what they want;
to break the ice they can always ask
the parents to join them in the
Mexican hat dance, or a "Let's all
pat ourselves on the back" exercise
such as the one above right.  
Something, anything rather than
stonewalling.

Why have supes circled the
wagons?
Could it be that wagon circling is a
natural extension of the rah-rah
good-news-only PR path public
schools have been storming down
of late?   
There be some dancin' in
the streets in Ysleta ISD
California - Colorado - Florida
Iowa - New York - Tennessee
Texas -  Washington
Lake Travis ISD
When Lake Travis ISD
took a mom and a dad to
court
for filing (they said) too
many public records requests
on Thursday, October 26, it took
Travis County District Civil
Court
Judge Suzanne
Covington
less than an hour to
throw out the suit, not even
allowing
LTISD's attorney,
Bracewell & Giuliani partner
J.
David Thompson, III
do his
PowerPoint presentation,
advising him he should take up
the matter with the state
legislature-- where we, a handful
of moms organized as
Texans
for Education Accountability
--
had last year defeated HB 2264,
Education, Inc.'s previous
attempt to rein in parents and
taxpayers filing public records
requests, so much so that the
bill's initiator, then-representa-
tive
Todd Baxter, resigned a few
months later.
Scenes above and below from Ysleta
ISD videos shown across the nation by
their superintendent Hector Montenegro.
Ysleta ISD supe Hector Montenegro
(above left)
Cleburne ISD
David Thompson (center) in
court Oct. 26 on behalf of
Lake Travis ISD; LTISD PR gal
Melissa Loe (far right)
The question now on the
table:
 Is Baxter's replacement,
Democrat Donna Howard, brave
enough to tackle authoring
anti-sunshine legislation?  Both
Lake Travis ISD and Eanes ISD
are in her district.  

Another question on the
table:
 Thompson, who is also
listed in the
Texas Ethics
Commission
roster of paid
lobbyists as representing the
powerful supes' union, the
Texas
Association of School
Administrators,
lives in Houston.
Will he persuade his local
representative there to file the
anti-sunshine legislation he
seems to be wanting to impose
on Texas taxpayers?

Still another question on
the table:
 Both Eanes and
Lake Travis are paying the
Texas
Ass'n of School Boards
for use
of their
BoardBook software.  
BoardBook offers for free a
"Check Register" feature.  Rather
than paying Mr. Thompson and
any other attorneys to dodge
producing what are after all at the
end of the day public records of
how these districts are spending
taxpayer dollars,
why don't Eanes
and Lake Travis simply post
their check registers online?  
Every town in America needs
people like Teresa Blackwell
and Don Rice (above).
 Teresa, the
mother of two CISD students, is founder
and chair of ACCE$S Cleburne ISD, a
group of parents and taxpayers who are
working to help improve Cleburne ISD
schools; she is also publishing a history
of local Cleburne ISD schools.  Don is
publisher and editor of the Cleburne
Eagle News, which has been fearless in
its reporting of the group's findings.
Ysleta ISD
$436,804,801annual income
buys a lot of PR.
Ysleta ISD has a student popula-
tion of 46,000 and total receipts for
the 2004-05 school year (the most
recent reported) for all funds of
$436,804,801, which means
Ysleta's spending a whopping and
very generous $9500 per student
per year.  And yet, Montenegro was
written up glowingly for talking
during the 2004 Robin Hood trial
"simply and eloquently about the
desperate conditions and extreme
needs of [his] campuses and
students–and [his] inability to raise
the resources to improve those
conditions, given the financial
circumstances" in his community.  
(SOURCE--Michael King/Austin
Chronicle)
Member Harold Gentry
(right) has been filing public
records requests for the
past two years.  First came
last year's $908.61steak
dinner for the supe and the
board at the TASB Summer
Leadership Institute in San
Antonio.  
More about this
meal here
Micki and Alden Nellis filed
public records requests
also, and started a website
for posting their findings:
www.cleburnepolitics.com
Harold
Gentry

Micki
Nellis

Alden
Nellis
White Bluff Resort
(PHOTO/R.Muniz)
Then along came the White
Bluff Resort receipts.
Harold has to date uncovered
$18,828.05 in receipts for district retreats
at resorts such as White Bluff at Lake
Whitney (above); another three CISD
retreats were held at Garrett Creek
Ranch in Paradise, Texas.  Some of the
stayovers were labeled "The Principals
Academy."

Details regarding the resort stays have
been published both on the Nellis' site
and in the Cleburne Eagle News.
No wonder Montenegro
employs a PR staff of
eleven (above).
 That's at least,
what, six or eight teaching
positions?  While my natural
assumption would be they spend
their time spinning, trying to make
$9500 per student not sound like
much, the district says otherwise:  
YISD's PR guys and gals "promote,
plan and execute special events.
The PR team is a key force behind
annual events, such as the Teacher
of the Year gala and the
back-to-school convocation for
employees, as well as numerous
other district-wide recognitions and
celebrations."  

Without wanting to sound like the
Grinch that stole Christmas, are
these events necessary?  Do
teachers need galas and $5,000
speakers for the first day of school?  
As many receipts as I've looked
through over the years, events such
as these all look like money pits to
me, money pits that have nothing to
do with the teacher in the
classroom.  

Does the PR work?
Even with almost a half-billion
dollars coming in, superintendent
Hector Montenegro appears to be
experiencing the same difficulties
as two districts back, in San
Marcos.  Last June the El Paso
Times said, "YISD looks to make up
$10 million shortfall.  If the Ysleta
Independent School District wants
to meet its budgetary goals for the
2006-07 academic year, it will have
to find a way to come up with $10
million. Superintendent Hector
Montenegro said that the district is
not in a deficit, but that the money
must be found if the board wants to
increase its reserves to the
recommended $40 million."  

The financial difficulties came to
light a few years ago when
Montenegro applied for another job:
Jennifer Riggs and partner Bill
Aleshire, attorneys for Lake
Travis ISD parents David and
Melissa Lovelace, preparing to
leave court Thursday, Oct. 26
after judge threw out
Lake Travis ISD's lawsuit
against the parents.
JENNIFER RIGGS'
STATEMENT
As open government advocates,
we are delighted that the Court
decided to dismiss the school
district’s claims.  To rule
otherwise would open the door
to the government filing lawsuits
against its citizens about any
number of other public rights
the government claimed were
used “too much.”  Had the
district been devoted to the spirit
of the Public Information Act and
used the web and other
computer resources to make
information readily available to
parents, taxpayers, and other
members of the public, these
parents would never have had
cause to be so persistent.  
When government resists being
open, thank goodness there are
citizens like David and Melissa
Lovelace who are willing to take
them to task.
Eanes ISD
Eanes moms Susan Bushart has
published a series of "Community
Updates" and Dianna Pharr a website,
"Keep Eanes Informed."

And they both have continued to seek
more information and also to be
generous community resources for
others seeking information.

Here's an example of the several
attempts Dianna has made to obtain a
copy of  Eanes' check register:
DIANNA'S INITIAL REQUEST
From: Dianna Pharr
Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006
11:07 AM
To: OpenRecords
Subject: TPIA - check register

Please provide, electronically, the
check register for 05-06.  Please do not
include the payroll.

Please also provide, electronically, the
check register for 04-05.  Please do not
include the payroll.

I am not seeking bank account
numbers or social security numbers.  If
the districts wishes to exempt
information that is confidential by law,
please let me know so that we can
work together to avoid the cost and
delay of an OAG opinion request.

Thank you,

Dianna Pharr
"Board trustee Roberto Lerma told
the El Paso Times that
Montenegro was a candidate,
saying the public deserved to
know about how Montenegro
managed funds while superin-
tendent for the school district in
San Marcos, Texas, during 1996
to 2001.  Trustee Rosa Caballero
said, 'I feel the community has the
right to know--that if we feel there's
a problem, we should let them
know.... But how do you do that
without disclosing things that
were discussed in closed
session?'  Lerma said that during
Montenegro's term, the district's
'rainy day fund' dwindled
drastically. The money was used
mostly for academic programs
and for the rising cost of health
insurance."  
(SOURCE--El Paso
Reporter-News)
DIANNA'S CLARIFICATION
From:  Dianna Pharr
Sent:  11/1/2006 7:59 AM

For the sake of efficiency, please send
the 05-06 check register to me
electronically.

Thank you,

Dianna Pharr
ATTACHMENT 1
Ramnath Subramanian is a
U.S. citizen originally from Kerala,
India, a former U.S. Army officer who
now teaches at Ysleta ISD.  He also
runs a free school on the side for
children in the community; courses
offered recently included:  "Study of
poetic forms: the villanelle,"
"Introduction to trigonometry," "Math
for lower grades" and "Basic
economics/ personal finance."

Here's more about Ram and last
July's taping incident:
EANES' IN-HOUSE
ATTORNEY'S RESPONSE
From: OpenRecords
Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006
9:03 AM
To: Dianna Pharr
Subject: Re: FW: check registers

Ms. Pharr, with all due respect I simply
don't have time to scan the
voluminous documents.  A file full of
paper documents (about a ream's
worth) exist in paper format and are
available for your immediate
inspection today.  Therefore, I am
prepared to proceed as we planned
earlier this week.  If you need to
reschedule the meeting for later in
the week, that is fine.

Bernadette Gonzalez
Coordinator, Records and Legal
Services
Eanes Independent School District
OpenRecords@eanes.k12.tx.us
LAKE TRAVIS ISD SUPE
ROCKY KIRK'S
STATEMENT
Late last month, Travis County
District Judge Suzanne
Covington granted the plea to the
jurisdiction requested by David
and Melissa Lovelace in the
lawsuit filed by the Lake Travis
Independent School District
against the Lovelaces for
creating a public nuisance. Since
June 2005, the Lovelaces have
submitted approximately 2,274
public information requests to
the school district. Also, they
have made over 70 formal
grievances and numerous other
informal complaints during that
timeframe. Since June 2005, the
school district has spent over
$700,000, primarily for attorney's
fees and lost staff time,
responding to the requests and
complaints filed by the
Lovelaces. Dr. Rocky Kirk,
Superintendent of Schools of the
Lake Travis ISD, said, "Our
school district is disappointed
that the Court did not recognize
the serious interference that the
Lovelaces' actions are causing
with the district's ability to
educate all of the children in our
community. We are proud of our
efforts to make information
available to all of our
constituents, but we continue to
believe that the Lovelaces'
actions are unreasonable and
overly burdensome. No
individual should be permitted to
misuse resources that are
intended to benefit the entire
community."   The school district
will decide later this month if it
plans to appeal the court’s
decision.
The Ysleta Independent School
District Board of Trustees on
Wednesday heard from several
supporters of Ramnath
Subramanian--the former Hacienda
Heights Elementary School teacher
who was reassigned in what he
called violations of his freedom of
speech.  Subramanian attended
the meeting and, when called upon
to address the board during
citizen's input, tore a strip of gray
duct tape from a roll he brought with
him and placed it over his mouth.
He stood by the microphone for the
three minutes allowed to speakers,
silenced by the tape in a room full
of people and district officials.  
Subramanian maintains that his
weekly columns in the El Paso
Times, which often criticize district
practices and other state policies,
are the reason he was moved out
of his teaching position at
Hacienda Heights.  Ysleta officials
said the reassignment had nothing
to do with his writing for the
newspaper.  
(Ibid.)
DIANNA'S FURTHER
CLARIFICATION
From: Dianna Pharr
Sent: Wednesday, November 01, 2006
9:27 AM
To: Open Records
Subject: check registers

Ms. Gonzalez,

Sorry you misunderstood ... I am not
requesting that you "scan" the check
register.  Rather, I expect that the very
information that you plan to produce in
paper form exists electronically on the
Eanes ISD computer.  Eanes
purchased very costly accounting
software over a year ago.  I expect that
the check register that you have in
paper is available electronically and
can be emailed to me or provided on a
CD very easily.  

This seems like the most efficient and
least costly way for me to receive the
information and for the district to
provide the information.  I have
attached my original request (below as
Attachment 1) specifying that I wish to
receive the check registers
electronically.

I hope this clarifies my request to
receive the information electronically.  I
will see you at 1:30 today to inspect the
documents for 04-05 unless those can
also be produced electronically.

I hope the district will work with me
towards the most efficient request and
provision of this basic public
information.  As you know I requested
this information many weeks ago on
September 20, 2006.  I have made
every effort to work patiently with the
district and will continue to do so.

I appreciate your assistance.

Thank you,

Dianna Pharr
Wondering still why Hector
Montenegro and his board think
it's okay for administrators to
dress up in serapes and dance
around but it's not okay for
teachers to tell the truth.

I've been meaning to ask Hector
this exact question.  He promised
to send me the two tapes these
photos are from--these pix are
from a workshop during the Jan.
31, 2006 TASA Midwinter
Conference, from the screen.  
Then he was going to send them a
couple of times later.  They still
haven't come.  Maybe if Ysleta
employed 12 PR guys and gals
rather than just 11 they'd have
arrived by now; on the other hand,
it's only been ten months.
Just so we're all clear
on the concept:
Is Rocky Kirk saying that
parents filing public records
requests are a nuisance but his
high school students dressing
like this all day at school
aren't?  Fashion'n'fun trump the
First Amendment?
Two other points
It appears that our same schools
that are bending over backwards
to preach tolerance could use a
good lesson in tolerance
themselves.

Also, other states would do well to
pay attention to these examples
from Texas if only as a cautionary
tale.  With so many other things
educational, as goes Texas so
goes the nation.  

Meaning you might be replicating
our goofs if you can't learn from
ours.  Coming soon to a theatre
near you.
NOTE:  Eanes ISD has
begun using TASB's
BoardBook software,
which offers a free
"Check Register" feature.
Leander ISD
The white banner worn by the
woman above right in jeans and
pink T-shirt reads, "#1 Mom."
Leander ISD, just beyond Eanes and Lake Travis ISD's on
the outskirts of Austin's suburban fringe, has a new parent
group,
Leander Kids First, and they're busy filing public
records requests; their website
http://leanderkidsfirst.net
Remember these
students  photo-
graphed a local coffee
bar
en route for
school dressed for
"Senior Initiation" on
the morning of Friday,
October 6, 2006?
A bunch of us are still
trying to figure out how
a supe can allow this
disruption but not
public records
requestors.
From their "What we stand for" statement:
* Academic robustness as the highest priority
* Revitalized science and engineering curricula
* Higher college enrollment rates
* Term limits for board of trustees
* Zero portable classrooms
* Student uniforms
* Very high transparency of internal operations: all major
documents in a web based repository for public access
* A clear, published curriculum for each grade
* Superintendent evaluations that include parent and faculty
inputs
* Board members who certify they have no direct or indirect
financial interest in the district  
Pete Isburgh
Why would a public school employee such as Lake Travis ISD's
supe Rocky Kirk live in a guarded gated community?
Does this strike you as being egalitarian, in the spirit of the equity
our public schools so often seek, or does it seem elitist?

How we take back our children's education:
one person, one question, one school at a time.



Reader Questions

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QUOTES



Separatists in
India's north-eastern
state of Manipur
have
shot six male
teachers in the leg
for allegedly
helping students
cheat in exams.

Two women
teachers were
beaten with sticks
for the same
offence, the rebels
of the Kanglei Yana
Kan Lup group said.
 The teachers were
abducted from their
homes after an
exam on Thursday.  

The rebels said
the teachers
took up to 5,000
rupees ($110) for
helping students
cheat
and warned
of further
punishment if the
cheating continued.  

The Kanglei
Yana Kan Lup
(KYKL) is one of
many separatist
groups fighting
Indian administration
in Manipur.  

It said it
abducted the eight
teachers from their
homes in and
around the state
capital, Imphal,
because of reports
they had
taken bribes.

--By Subir Bhaumik - BBC
ATTENTION EDUCATORS AND ADMINISTRATORS:
Every attempt possible has been made to verify all sources and information.   In the event you feel an error has been made, please contact us immediately.  Thank you.
Copyright 1999-2006 Peyton Wolcott
POP QUIZ:

How do you
yourself know for a
fact that your state
or local supe is
actually using the
funds entrusted to
them for the
correct purposes?



My
New
Book


PEYTON WOLCOTT
QUERY
THE SUPE
& THE PR GUY
TO:
KATHY COX-GEORGIA
SUP'T OF SCHOOLS &
CEO-GEORGIA DOE
CC:  
DANA TOFIG-
GEORGIA DOE
PUBLIC INFO. OFCR.
DATE:  JAN. 22, 2006

Can you please send me
the
annual dollar
amount
for each school
year (the five annual fiscal
cycles 2000-2005) that the
Georgia Public Schools
DOE has spent with
vendor
Computer
Consulting Services
Corp.
, described as a
consultant to Georgia's
DOE.
STATUS:
No response
rec'd from
Sup't Gray as of
Mar. 27, 2006


The question
is not how to
measure
excellence at
public schools
and education
agencies.

The question
is how to
measure
competence.

-- Dianna Pharr
QUERY
THE SUPE
(& CC THE BOARD)
DATE FIRST SENT:   
FEB. 14, 2006

RE-SENT 03/26/06

Dear Strongsville
Superintendent
James Gray:

I'm hoping you can
clear something up for
me for my book and
website regarding your
standards for
administrative
practices in
Strongsville as there
have been not one but
two situations this past
year warranting
scrutiny....  

Regarding special ed
teacher Christine
Scarlett's
offering a
date with herself as a
grades incentive

1.    What rules/
guidelines do you now
have in place to
assure that nothing
like this happens
again?
 Would these
be administrative
changes or has your
board set specific
policies in place for
you to follow in future?

2.    
Rumors of an affair
between Scarlett and
Bradigan persisted for
several months.  You
have stated that you
have no idea such an
affair was going on.  
Do you feel
the fact
that you are
commuting from your
home in
Akron (if this
has changed, please
let me know) has
adversely impacted
your ability to monitor
what's going on with
your employees in the
Strongsville
community in an
important and
sensitive area such as
this?  Has your board
since made a
condition of your
employment that you
move to
Strongsville
and become an
integral part of their
community?

Regarding the sex
education booklet
placed last fall in
young children's
lockers

4.    What guidelines
did you follow from
your established
board's policies for
such?  

5.    There appears to
be a growing number
of parents who want to
be consulted before
such materials are
given to their students.  
As one mom put it,
"What's wrong with so
many people in the
educational fields that
they don't even think
twice about providing
children with
inappropriate
materials and not even
consider the parents
wishes....Their tactics
mirror those used in
Communist China and
Cuba where children
are considered not
children of parents, but
wards of the State."  
While this is clearly the
statement of an upset
parent, it does raise an
interesting issue
regarding public
school administrators
in the U.S.  
Do you
consider the students
in your schools yours
to educate as you
deem best or the
offspring of parents to
be consulted before
disseminating such
materials?

Regarding trainings
and conferences

6.    Of which
education-related
associations are you
and Strongsville City
Schools a member?
 
What are these
organizations'
guidelines for
disseminating such
materials?

7.    In which
education-related
conferences have
your and your staff
participated this past
year?  Where were
they and what were
the costs for each?   
Have you attended any
other seminars,
workshops or the like
offering guidance in
this area, and what
were those costs?

It may well be that
there are perfectly
reasonable
explanations for your
approving the placing
sex-education
pamphlets in young
students' lockers
without notifying
parents first, and it may
also well be that there
is a perfectly
reasonable
explanation for your
allowing a teacher to
offer a date at the Dairy
Queen with herself to a
young student; if so, I
am eager to learn such
reason or reasons.
==================
She said the booklet,
which also provides
information on the need for
parental consent for
abortion and a Web
address for the
Lesbian/Gay Community
Service Center of Greater
Cleveland, is
inappropriate for
11-year-olds.  I believe
some sex education needs
to be given, but when
subjects are discussed or
material is given to kids of
this nature, a notice
should be sent home to
the parent and they should
be allowed to opt out of
the program if they wish,
Fleming said.  School
Superintendent James
Gray said he gave an OK
for the pocket-sized
directories, which were
provided to the district by
United Way Services in
conjunction with the
county health department
and county commissioners,
to be given to students at
the high school, middle
schools and to sixth
graders.  Gray said he
received two calls from
parents who took
exception to the booklet's
content.  I understand that
and probably, in
retrospect, I should have
considered sending a
letter along with it as far
as an explanation, he
said, adding, this is a
developing situation. I
don't know what we are
going to do at this point.  
Colleen Grady, a city
resident and a member of
the state school board,
said she got calls from four
parents concerned about
their children getting the
directory.  Grady, who is
also a former city school
board member, said she
has not personally seen
the publication, but they
(parents) read me sections
over the telephone.  She
said the state board of
education may wish to
make a legislative
recommendation to the
Ohio general assembly,
and the board could also
consider discussion about
adoption of a model policy
for the distribution of such
materials.  Gray said there
will be continued
discussion, in the district's
curriculum and pupil
services departments on
whether to curtail
distribution of materials
which are considered to
be sensitive, particularly
for the younger kids.
CONTACT:
Peyton Wolcott
P.O. Box 9068
Horseshoe Bay, TX  78657
peyton@peytonwolcott.com
F o c u s i n g
o n
accountability
f i r s t
Fallout
There are reports that the district has cut
back on its attendance at retreats.

According to a recent report published by
the Nellis's, "
Cleburne City Manager
Chester Nolen unilaterally banned the
Cleburne Eagle News from the Cleburne
Public Library.  Now the City is saying it
never happened.  However, we have
both the library personnel and Chester
Nolen on tape saying it did."

And Gentry has received correspon-
dence from TEA indicating an investiga-
tion of Cleburne ISD is underway.

Actual total receipts all funds for CISD
during the 2004-05 school year were
$82,230,173, with  6,407 students.
After reading Eanes ISD's
amicus curiae/friend of the
court brief
filed on behalf of
Lake Travis ISD,
California
attorney
Paul Nicholas Boylan
said, "I just read the Eanes
amicus brief.  They are actually
trying to equate civil nuisance
with the exercise of First
Amendment rights.  Forgive my
French (I just returned from
teaching in France, so perhaps
that is an adequate excuse) but
what a load of horse ____ .  It is
a civil nuisance if my dog barks
late at night and it annoys you.  It
isn't a civil nuisance if I exercise
my constitutional rights--no
matter how much it annoys you.   
If there is a price to pay in order
to allow the public to review
public records, that is a cost our
democracy must allow--whether
it is annoying or not. This is what
Lake Travis Independent School
District doesn't understand, or it
does not want to understand:
they have an obligation to allow
the public to review any public
record in the district's
possession, no matter how
much it annoys them to provide
those records.  If annoying
government officials is an
exception  to our First
Amendment rights, then this
exception will easily swallow the
right and render it meaningless.  
I am totally amazed anyone can
make those arguments with a
straight face and pretend they
are reasonable. They should be
ashamed of themselves."